RPS Limit

[Maverick]

Since the previous thread got locked due to some people not being able to post intelligently, I am posting this. If anyone says anything like they did in the last thread to derail it, this will get locked.

To KA staff, it had previously been stated that there will never be a RPS limit at KA. Why is this changing all of a sudden?

Secondly, to the comment about the fastest AEG being a KWA m4 with an 11.1v LiPo, that is simply not true. My AEG was running 35 RPS before P* even came about. I never had anyone complaining about me overkilling them, and no problems were had. For me this build was proof of the skill it can take to build an AEG, led to great trigger response, and was a thing of pride. Now anyone can go buy a P* and get the same thing with no effort, so that IMO is why this is becoming an issue.

That being said, I am VERY against a 24 RPS limitation at the Airhouse. Number one, that will make me unable to use my m4 without seriously detuning it. Secondly, one of the things that is highly sought after is a quick trigger response, which in an AEG is impossible to tune without upping the ROF.

Instead of putting all of these limitations on players and what they can use, hold people accountable. If someone gets accused of overkilling, watch them the same as if they are accused of not calling their hits. Personally, the only time I ever get overkilled is by newer players with rentals or stock guns. It seems that the majority of the people complaining about P* are new to the game.

TLDR, 24 RPS limitation is stupid, my AEG m4 has been running 35 RPS for 2.5 years now and there has never been an issue.

[gunny]

Mav hit the nail on the head.
I have never had a problem with Mav overkilling me.

[foxtrot]

I think the major problem is that you can tune down the P* to 280-300 and get the same effect as having it at 350, yet people keep there P* at 350 and 35-40 rps which even in burst can set triple the bb's some one with a 12 rps gun. Trigger response hasn't been shown by some players and is probably why they set the limit I don't think its fair to players that can't change there rps very easily. Mabye, just mabye they could make a rule that you can have higher rps but make it so that the fps is less than say 300, just an idea.

[gost]

I have played with people with p* and have never been over killed that I can remember and the rate of fire rule is dumb if I really wanted to just unload on some one it wouldn't make a difference if I had a gun with 12 RPS or one with 35 RPS. It all comes down to trigger responsibility it's not that hard, it only takes one bullet to get some one out. And that's my 2 cents on this subject.

[Maverick]

I have one gun shooting above 330 fps, and that is just because it is a shortstroked setup and removing a 3rd tooth wasnt necessary. All of my other guns shoot between 285-330 FPS because the 20 more FPS I can gain will give me no advantage, and in the rare instance I hit someone semi close or in a more sensitive area, it wont hurt as much. Most CQB places only allow you to shoot at 1 joule of energy, or 328 FPS.

My main concern is that my build, which the main goal of was trigger response (trigger response and ROF come hand in hand for AEGs), is now illegal at the Airhouse. That means I will have to detune a build that took skill, and something that I have pride in. Unlike a P* user that has to push a few buttons on an FCU chip. Heck, I just tested my UMP which is a very milf build, only having reliability mods and an older Ferrite magnet HS motor in it and it shoots 29 RPS. I dont even have to hardly try to breach 24 RPS.

[Miller]

I completely agree I had maverick upgrade my M4 for me a while back it shoots over 25 RPS at 320 FPS. I spent a lot of my own time and quit a bit of money to get my AEG exactly how I wanted it. I have never had a single complaint about overkilling anyone so now with this new rule I cant use my M4 or my TF11 now witch is extremely discouraging considering between the two Ive spent over $400 and now just like that your telling me I can no longer use them I'm sorry but that's just ridiculous. I realize your trying to run a business and safety is your number one priority but is this really the best course of action?

[Kilroy]

I suppose I'll chime in here.

Maverick called me tonight and told me "hey, they made a RPS limit". Now I didn't believe it but sure enough, I started reading. I'll just cut right to the chase.

This is not good. This is not good for the Airhouse, for Kalamazoo Airsoft, for Airsoft in general. Never before in 10 years of playing have I ever seen such a ridiculous rule. Usually rules that are made to limit something is made on something that can easily be limited. RPS is not one of those things. Sure you can put a crappier motor in but why would you want to risk your AEG with lesser parts?

Now, just a few years ago, Airsofters started using Lipo batteries as opposed to their regular NiCAD an NiMH batteries. One of the instant improvements with the Lipo is an increase in ROF. Now, take a KWA M4. Its 20 RPS stock right? Yea, being tested with NiCAD or NiMH batteries. Unfortunately, every airsofter I know uses Lipo's including Kalamazoo Airsoft. With an 11.1v Lipo in a KWA M4, it will be shooting above the new RPS limit. Many AEG's come stock shooting at ~20 RPS. But again, throw a Lipo on there and you are looking at what is now considered to be over the RPS limit. I had a bone stock G&P M4 shooting at 27 RPS. That is now unusable at the Airhouse. Mavericks M4, which he loves dearly and put a lot of time and effort into, is now unusable at the airhouse.

I am a P* user and have the luxury of changing my RPS whenever I want. This rule doesn't really effect me as I play semi-auto only at 300 fps mainly due to the fact of people demonizing the P* system. But for someone who's AEG is shooting over the RPS limit, its not so easy for them. They are forced to downgrade their motor or downgrade their battery. And even then, that's not guaranteed to lower your RPS enough. I.E. Maverick. Also, Im not too sure which P* user would be running at such a high ROF. Gunny, myself, and shamrock all run ours pretty much the same. Only other person I can think of that has a P* is Mike and he has pretty good trigger discipline.

A few weeks ago, there was a kid playing. He was using some kind of AK that was shooting well over the FPS limit. Yes, I said playing. Maverick and I did a surprise chrono on him to confirm. If KA cant even manage the FPS limit, then why put another limitation out there for them to manage? This is not a bash against KA at all. I really enjoy playing there when I'm able and have a blast with Hollis and Chad every time I'm there. Its a simple observation. Please take it for what it is.

With all that said, I think this rule is not very well thought it, and the only reason its even being discussed is because of newer players or younger players that either A) don't know how to control their trigger finger or B) Don't call their hits and continue to get pelted by plastic death.

[Kilroy]

Nov 1, 2012 21:06:44 GMT -5 Maverick said:

Heck, I just tested my UMP which is a very milf build.

Lol...Milf.

[Cheese]

so now we cant use kmp9s too? i dont know exact rof, but it is dang fast! i say gun control

[Spaz {Clanless}]

Simply put, the rps limit is addressing a non-issue. Holding overkillers accountable is what needs to be done.

[Cheese]

just cause one person overkills doesnt mean the whole community needs to suffer, address each person that overkills seperatly

[Kilroy]

If you are being overkilled then you need to tell a ref. If you keep getting shot because you are failing to say hit, then put those hands up and walk back to spawn because you wont find sympathy from the person shooting you.

These are all VERY basic airsoft rules. An RPS rule should not have to be implemented.

[Miller]

Exactly it doesn't matter what gun I'm using if those hands aren't up or you didn't yell hit your getting shot again plain and simple.

[Hunt81]

So let me just say this guys, rather than everybody telling KA how bad of a decision you thought they've made, let try and come up with the solution. You guys obviously don't like there to be a limit but for the exception of Foxtrot nobody is really trying to help find a great solution.

You guys know how hard it is to catch people in the act of breaking rules, unless your the one they are doing it to. Yes I agree more random crono's should be done and that's something they are addressing. Do they need to crono at the start of each round? It's a little much but somehow over powered guns make it out onto the field.

I can't say I have to solution myself but all I know is KA would be a lot more willing to talk through this if there was more help in the solution.

[Spaz {Clanless}]

I think that the solution is in the hands of the players at this point. Bringing things up to the refs helps. If they don't know about a problem, they can't help fix it. Don't be afraid to tell the refs anything if you have an issue.